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	<title>Comments on: Schopenhauer&#8217;s Extreme Self-Help for Pessimists</title>
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	<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php</link>
	<description>Understand your mind with the science of psychology -</description>
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		<title>By: Dustin</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-25706</link>
		<dc:creator>Dustin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 11:05:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-25706</guid>
		<description>I think putting the advice of someone who lived in another age into &quot;right&quot; and &quot;wrong&quot; based on studies done in the present is a bit short sighted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think putting the advice of someone who lived in another age into "right" and "wrong" based on studies done in the present is a bit short sighted.</p>
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		<title>By: Cyp</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-24406</link>
		<dc:creator>Cyp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 11:13:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-24406</guid>
		<description>I believe Mr S was right in about 80% and the researchers only tested a certain group of people and their opinions hold bias.

First: the points in our relationship with others are 100% corect. 

Second: The solution is not to avoid contact to society... that can only be accepted as extreme solution when anything else fails. Instead try not to expect anything from anyone : if you have high expectations from someone they always let you down. Instead expect the worst from them and accept them how they are. By doing this You accomplish two things: first, they will always try to show they&#039;re better side(s) , second, no matter what they do it would seem a good thing to you because you expected the worst and that is better.

Though the world is full of fools, it doesn&#039;t mean they cannot change, it only means they don&#039;t want to change, because they like this way.

Trying to change them, although sometimes is succesfull it takes to much energy consumption.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe Mr S was right in about 80% and the researchers only tested a certain group of people and their opinions hold bias.</p>
<p>First: the points in our relationship with others are 100% corect. </p>
<p>Second: The solution is not to avoid contact to society... that can only be accepted as extreme solution when anything else fails. Instead try not to expect anything from anyone : if you have high expectations from someone they always let you down. Instead expect the worst from them and accept them how they are. By doing this You accomplish two things: first, they will always try to show they're better side(s) , second, no matter what they do it would seem a good thing to you because you expected the worst and that is better.</p>
<p>Though the world is full of fools, it doesn't mean they cannot change, it only means they don't want to change, because they like this way.</p>
<p>Trying to change them, although sometimes is succesfull it takes to much energy consumption.</p>
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		<title>By: zaroff</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-22094</link>
		<dc:creator>zaroff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 16:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-22094</guid>
		<description>Schopenhauer is best imbibed by those of us who understand the necessity of misanthropy, ie: we who are inclined by our nature to be &#039;like&#039; Schopenhauer.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I am in many ways very similar in construct. His writing, like that of Pessoas, holds the attention by its lucid account of what we share as &#039;eccentrics&#039;, &#039;misanthropes&#039;, or just plain pitying the world that we have to endure.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As such, if you go seeking so called &#039;happiness&#039; you will not in any Schopenhauerian sense &#039;find&#039; it. Savouring a personality through the filter of his works seems to me, as an oddball, happiness personified. Until i move onto the next world-weary font of sensibility.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;go thou unto Schopenhauer &amp; Cioran will surely follow..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Schopenhauer is best imbibed by those of us who understand the necessity of misanthropy, ie: we who are inclined by our nature to be &#39;like&#39; Schopenhauer.</p>
<p>I am in many ways very similar in construct. His writing, like that of Pessoas, holds the attention by its lucid account of what we share as &#39;eccentrics&#39;, &#39;misanthropes&#39;, or just plain pitying the world that we have to endure.</p>
<p>As such, if you go seeking so called &#39;happiness&#39; you will not in any Schopenhauerian sense &#39;find&#39; it. Savouring a personality through the filter of his works seems to me, as an oddball, happiness personified. Until i move onto the next world-weary font of sensibility.</p>
<p>go thou unto Schopenhauer &amp; Cioran will surely follow..</p>
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		<title>By: k</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-22082</link>
		<dc:creator>k</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 23:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thank you very much, mr Scientist, for pointing out what is right and what is wrong in the Philosophy of Arthur Schopenhauer!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you very much, mr Scientist, for pointing out what is right and what is wrong in the Philosophy of Arthur Schopenhauer!</p>
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		<title>By: name</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-21751</link>
		<dc:creator>name</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 05:47:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-21751</guid>
		<description>Interesting that people commenting on a philosophy blog have &#039;trouble&#039; with spelling and syntax to the point of actually throwing up layers of meaning hidden by a literally correct version. Being literal and in agreement with present life and the norms of communication are, I think, the most pleasant way of getting through that old conception of I and other. However, I love the creative possibilities of a new language. Thanks for the blog, fell on it as I read Einstein liked Schopenhauer. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Although I know nothing of it, I do notice a passing resemblance to taoism and Buddist thought from your description, and a certain desire to judge and lead through  the bad good continuum, which is one way to the right</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting that people commenting on a philosophy blog have 'trouble' with spelling and syntax to the point of actually throwing up layers of meaning hidden by a literally correct version. Being literal and in agreement with present life and the norms of communication are, I think, the most pleasant way of getting through that old conception of I and other. However, I love the creative possibilities of a new language. Thanks for the blog, fell on it as I read Einstein liked Schopenhauer. </p>
<p>Although I know nothing of it, I do notice a passing resemblance to taoism and Buddist thought from your description, and a certain desire to judge and lead through  the bad good continuum, which is one way to the right</p>
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		<title>By: diogene</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-21453</link>
		<dc:creator>diogene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Mar 2008 14:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-21453</guid>
		<description>Except general presentation, all article appear to my like a joke.&lt;br /&gt;1. Don&#039;t seek whealth is synonym whit don&#039;t seek statut. Don&#039;t desire anything from life.&lt;br /&gt;2.Avoid people. Which are the factors who affect the most human spirit ? Human relations. How can you avoid ?&lt;br /&gt;4.Avoid problems. Yes is a posibility to be happy. All you life you will have destitution, needs,truble, what meen this, to be a unhappy men. If you try to disconect from reality, you will discovery a kind of happy, a inside reconciliation. What can to achieve a man from life, when he can&#039;t take anything whit him ?&lt;br /&gt;3. Mariage. This is a more compicated query, than can I depscribe in some words.&lt;br /&gt;P.S. Modern psychology is a joke, beisde Sopenhauer psychology.Look at him, at his actions, reactions,expectations...&lt;br /&gt;Sorry, for my bad english!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Except general presentation, all article appear to my like a joke.<br />1. Don't seek whealth is synonym whit don't seek statut. Don't desire anything from life.<br />2.Avoid people. Which are the factors who affect the most human spirit ? Human relations. How can you avoid ?<br />4.Avoid problems. Yes is a posibility to be happy. All you life you will have destitution, needs,truble, what meen this, to be a unhappy men. If you try to disconect from reality, you will discovery a kind of happy, a inside reconciliation. What can to achieve a man from life, when he can't take anything whit him ?<br />3. Mariage. This is a more compicated query, than can I depscribe in some words.<br />P.S. Modern psychology is a joke, beisde Sopenhauer psychology.Look at him, at his actions, reactions,expectations...<br />Sorry, for my bad english!</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-21159</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jan 2008 18:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-21159</guid>
		<description>Bob dylan and I would agree with that last comment. (see the Scorsese film) For us it is not a question of the pursuit of happiness. That is just not where it is at. The statistics in the modern research are irrelevant to us. Do you take the word &#039;blessed&#039; in the Sermon on the Mount to mean &#039;happy&#039;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bob dylan and I would agree with that last comment. (see the Scorsese film) For us it is not a question of the pursuit of happiness. That is just not where it is at. The statistics in the modern research are irrelevant to us. Do you take the word 'blessed' in the Sermon on the Mount to mean 'happy'?</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-21070</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 20:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The research in used to judge Schopenhauer&#039;s advice is not relevant to it.  The people tested were not applying a Schopenhaurian worldview therefore there results are irrelevant.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The research in used to judge Schopenhauer's advice is not relevant to it.  The people tested were not applying a Schopenhaurian worldview therefore there results are irrelevant.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeremy (PsyBlog author)</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-21067</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeremy (PsyBlog author)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jan 2008 09:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-21067</guid>
		<description>Wjz, in a way you&#039;re right. It&#039;s a little unfair to judge Schopenhauer&#039;s advice against a higher standard of happiness. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Hi Yeo Zhiyuan, thanks for your comment. Philosophers can (and do) argue about the meaning of words forever. What Schalkx &amp; Bergsma are trying to get at, though, is the spirit of Schopenhauer&#039;s advice. And the spirit of his advice is often mistaken when compared to modern psychological research on the conditions of happiness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wjz, in a way you're right. It's a little unfair to judge Schopenhauer's advice against a higher standard of happiness. </p>
<p>Hi Yeo Zhiyuan, thanks for your comment. Philosophers can (and do) argue about the meaning of words forever. What Schalkx &amp; Bergsma are trying to get at, though, is the spirit of Schopenhauer&#39;s advice. And the spirit of his advice is often mistaken when compared to modern psychological research on the conditions of happiness.</p>
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		<title>By: Yeo Zhiyuan</title>
		<link>http://www.spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for.php/comment-page-1#comment-21044</link>
		<dc:creator>Yeo Zhiyuan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 18:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spring.org.uk/2008/01/schopenhauers-extreme-self-help-for-pessimists.php#comment-21044</guid>
		<description>Schopenhauer mentioned quite frequently of the word &#039;Will&#039; and in this article, you had interpreted Will as &#039;Desire&#039;. But what Schopenhauer really meant by the word Will was actually &#039;Instinct&#039;. Look at a dog. What a dog does everyday is pretty routine - sleep, eat, bark at strangers, run-around, eat, and sleep (and occasional sex). It is all instinctive. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Due to our complex activities, human daily routine is not as straight-forward as a dog. But this do not change the fact that human&#039;s behaviour are instinctive too. Fundamentally, our basic instinct do not differ much from a dog(for instance: it is instinctive for human and dog to have babies to continue the next generation.)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Hence, the argument put fourth by Schopenhauer was - Instinct creates Desire and Desire brings Suffering.(Definition of Suffering - The absence of Absolute Happiness. That means, something as mild as boredom is an act of Suffering taking place within ourselves)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Therefore, Schopenhauer maintained that the rule Will(Instinct)-&gt;Desire-&gt;Suffering is the &#039;Truth&#039; in our life. We can&#039;t change it. That&#039;s why, we are always never satisfied and keep chasing dreams and dwell in the past, hence the Maslow&#039;s hierarchy of needs. That&#039;s why according to Schopenhauer, human endlessly seek Satisfaction (yes, Schopenhauer meant Satisfaction, not Happiness. The difference is, Satisfaction is more of short-term while attaining Happiness means having it in our mindset)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;One pyschological condition of human being is that we always want to look &#039;politically correct&#039; - basically we only want to associate ourselves with the good stuffs and subconsciously reject the bad stuffs(hence one of the reason why we always fool ourselves). Schopenhauer and Buddhism were merely bold enough to remind us, human, that our world is actually a world where Good and Bad stuffs co-exist together. We will have a better life and suffer less (physically and mentally) if we dare to face the reality of the ugly side of this world instead of remaining ignorant. We will also suffer less if we decide to understand and defy our Desire caused by our Instinct and stop chasing Satisfaction.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Example: Human has strong desire to gain wealth and power. But if we are never satisfied with what we have gained, we will forever go on and on chasing endless dream. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Last but not least, in your points of &#039;What Schopenhauer got wrong&#039;, i have never read before where he said to &#039;Avoid Problems&#039; and &#039;Avoid People&#039;. He definitely said something along the lines but i&#039;m very sure it is not as how as you had interpreted. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;For me, i would want to passionately read a philosopher&#039;s work first before writing a blog post. As Ludwig Wittgenstein mentioned before, confusion in philosophy is often due to wrong interpretation and definition of words.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Schopenhauer mentioned quite frequently of the word 'Will' and in this article, you had interpreted Will as 'Desire'. But what Schopenhauer really meant by the word Will was actually 'Instinct'. Look at a dog. What a dog does everyday is pretty routine - sleep, eat, bark at strangers, run-around, eat, and sleep (and occasional sex). It is all instinctive. </p>
<p>Due to our complex activities, human daily routine is not as straight-forward as a dog. But this do not change the fact that human's behaviour are instinctive too. Fundamentally, our basic instinct do not differ much from a dog(for instance: it is instinctive for human and dog to have babies to continue the next generation.)</p>
<p>Hence, the argument put fourth by Schopenhauer was - Instinct creates Desire and Desire brings Suffering.(Definition of Suffering - The absence of Absolute Happiness. That means, something as mild as boredom is an act of Suffering taking place within ourselves)</p>
<p>Therefore, Schopenhauer maintained that the rule Will(Instinct)-&gt;Desire-&gt;Suffering is the &#39;Truth&#39; in our life. We can&#39;t change it. That&#39;s why, we are always never satisfied and keep chasing dreams and dwell in the past, hence the Maslow&#39;s hierarchy of needs. That&#39;s why according to Schopenhauer, human endlessly seek Satisfaction (yes, Schopenhauer meant Satisfaction, not Happiness. The difference is, Satisfaction is more of short-term while attaining Happiness means having it in our mindset)</p>
<p>One pyschological condition of human being is that we always want to look 'politically correct' - basically we only want to associate ourselves with the good stuffs and subconsciously reject the bad stuffs(hence one of the reason why we always fool ourselves). Schopenhauer and Buddhism were merely bold enough to remind us, human, that our world is actually a world where Good and Bad stuffs co-exist together. We will have a better life and suffer less (physically and mentally) if we dare to face the reality of the ugly side of this world instead of remaining ignorant. We will also suffer less if we decide to understand and defy our Desire caused by our Instinct and stop chasing Satisfaction.</p>
<p>Example: Human has strong desire to gain wealth and power. But if we are never satisfied with what we have gained, we will forever go on and on chasing endless dream. </p>
<p>Last but not least, in your points of 'What Schopenhauer got wrong', i have never read before where he said to 'Avoid Problems' and 'Avoid People'. He definitely said something along the lines but i'm very sure it is not as how as you had interpreted. </p>
<p>For me, i would want to passionately read a philosopher's work first before writing a blog post. As Ludwig Wittgenstein mentioned before, confusion in philosophy is often due to wrong interpretation and definition of words.</p>
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